You have to think the current administration is completely and totally owned by foreign interests at this point.
The question is, what do you do as the new administration coming in? Presumably you assume every system and every person is compromised all the way down, like a compromised server - clean wipe and re-install.
One would assume that, like any good hacker, the current set would be heavily focused on ensuring they can survive a reboot / wipe. The question is, what would they be doing to achieve that?
Prosecute and show no mercy, the current Iran war probably will still be going on when the new administration comes in. The only hope for Mr. Kushner and some of the other people is a rapid peace treaty before the end of this mixed-up administration even that probably will not help.
Unless this administration is held responsible for their actions, I think it's safe to say that the incoming administration is compromised too. We had a bunch of hullabaloo from the Democrats about Russian influence and zero about Israeli influence (which is much more overt, severe and out in the open), so it sure looks like our entire government is a rooted server at this point.
Azerbaijan isn't a random country in corruption contexts. It is a petro-state and run by a single family for their own enrichment. It's pretty expected to come up occasionally in these kind of stories.
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A lot of people still don't believe it despite increasing levels of proof. The proof is fighting against the world's most powerful media empires, which also prevent access to the proof.
Not to make this political, but if the democrats gain control they better at least actually try to prosecute these criminals and not just make it yet another circle jerk asking for donations and never actually accomplishing anything. At some point the ruling class is going to mess around and everyone’s head ends up on a pile regardless. This is the time to demonstrate your head doesn’t deserve on the pile too. Time is running out. Just saying. Things happen fast when they finally cross that threshold that always comes as a surprise.
On one hand, we have an email server where most of the classified information on it was classified for her own protection - like her location.
Meanwhile Trump and plenty of others have also practiced extremely poor email hygiene using non-official emails for all sorts of stuff. You don't hear about that from the Left because, well, there's all sorts of far more concerning shit happening.
Then, on the other hand, there's staggeringly large and previously unprecedented levels of corruption with this administration. We've never seen anything remotely like it, unless your argument is just that the Democrats are just vastly more competent at hiding it, despite constantly having all sorts of shit leak and just generally being totally incompetent at managing the party itself.
But if you don't understand the difference between the Hillary email situation and the staggering amount of blatantly illegal and massively corrupt things coming out of the Trump administration basically every single day, I don't know that there's any level of proof or any argument that could be made to change your mind.
Yes, the MO of the Trump administration is to blame the other side of what they're actually doing.
Loudly making unfounded or exaggerated claims of corruption is a pretty effective tool for muddying the waters and making it less clear where the smoke is coming from.
I also feel people are missing the forest for the trees in that discussion in that Jared Kushner is a private citizen and the son in law of the president who somehow is negotiating with foreign heads of states despite having no mandate from the American people to do so. Forget a hacked phone, why is a nepo baby running around negotiating on behalf of a country without holding any office
Is there an alternate reality where the dem aligned mass media didn't completely bury the ridiculously salacious laptop story (drugs, money for access aaaand onlyfans level nudity!!) to steer the election?
Because i distinctly recall the head of what to that point I though was a credible journalistic organization saying she didnt want to "waste people's time" with that.
The alternate reality is the one where "dem aligned mass media _did_ completely bury" -- because it's all I heard about for months, and months, and months, and months, and months, and months, and months, and months, and months, and months, and months, and months, and months, and months.
Biden's laptop was in the possession of a computer shop in the US, and the owner leaked its contents to the media.
Kushner's phone data was in the possession of Dutch intelligence who didn't want anyone to know that they had hacked the phone, and this was not public knowledge until today.
Biden’s laptop was in the possession of “someone” who brought it to a blind computer repair person (seriously!), who then got in touch with Rudy Giuliani, who then leaked the contents to the media… and so we can’t really know who actually gained possession of it. The repair man was blind lol.
I think it's becoming clear that although the media just happily accepts the left-wing bias accusations, they are by no means left-wing. They shouted every random Biden mistake from the rooftops while this administration mostly gets a free pass.
"Corruption" isn't quite the right scale to use for this. Far deeper, more systemic. This is the disassembly of a state.
Much more equivalent to phenomenon surrounding the collapse of the Soviet Union: liquidation of an entire state's infrastructure via foreign exchange controlled exclusively by the security state . . with plenty of братва duocracy of course.
We've already seen equivalents, even before the 2008 Econopalypse, but activities like those of the Trump-affiliated circle is the terminal end: where USD-denominated assets are exchanged for pure state power. It's just that this is a particularly pure form of it.
There will be no unravelling of this, not until the system of USD seigniorage itself unravels.
This is the right answer to this. This is the beginning of dismantling of USD based system, US might suffer because of that but other countries now have no choice at all but to decouple the system relying in USD.
why would you need to destroy anything if there's pardons involved. Even if they have the proof you committed wrongdoing, the pardon means you suffer no consequences.
> why would you need to destroy anything if there's pardons involved.
To prosecute people guilty of state-level violations (which are not covered by Presidential federal-level pardons). To find 'collaborators' (and perhaps prosecute them, as it may difficult to pardon 'everyone'). To know what happened to perhaps help prevent it happening again in the future.
My understanding is that they don't need to destroy records related to Kushner because he's not a government employee, his records aren't required to be retained. And that is, no doubt, by design.
This kind of stuff gives an insight into how horrible centralized governance is. All these manipulations happening behind the scenes constantly which people are affected by but can't make sense of. It's not really surprising though, it's just part of the system. The system is designed in a way to attract certain people and make them behave a certain way. Power should be much more decentralized so that this doesn't happen.
Then there should be a centralized power whose only power is to enforce the decentralization of power. Basically a bunch of agents who go around and get paid to legally remove from power anyone who gets too powerful politically or financially and that's all they do and can do. There should be a crime 'Overaccumulation of power' which carries a jail sentence and a special court made up of a large random jury who vote on each case.
The jury is asked to vote if a person is too powerful and also there is a question "Do you recognize who this person/entity is?" and if some non-trivial percentage of people answer 'yes', then they it means this person has too much power and they get removed from all their positions immediately. Also there can be another test like this related to wealth; so if wealth is above a certain high limit (like $100 million), they are offered to either donate everything above the limit to a UBI fund or they go to jail until the amount falls below the limit.
I think such system would out-compete centralized systems which do not have such limits.
I am very jaded about the current administration and also the previous...few...or several? That being said, similar to the Hunter Biden laptop situation, I think you do have to be careful. Sure they -could- have the device or it -could- have been hacked, but what is the proof that the hacked or on-device information wasn't planted among real items to make it appear legitimate? That was always the big if for me with the Hunter stuff, so I will extend the same skepticism here, knowing full well it could definitely be true in either case.
You have to think the current administration is completely and totally owned by foreign interests at this point.
The question is, what do you do as the new administration coming in? Presumably you assume every system and every person is compromised all the way down, like a compromised server - clean wipe and re-install.
One would assume that, like any good hacker, the current set would be heavily focused on ensuring they can survive a reboot / wipe. The question is, what would they be doing to achieve that?
Prosecute and show no mercy, the current Iran war probably will still be going on when the new administration comes in. The only hope for Mr. Kushner and some of the other people is a rapid peace treaty before the end of this mixed-up administration even that probably will not help.
Unless this administration is held responsible for their actions, I think it's safe to say that the incoming administration is compromised too. We had a bunch of hullabaloo from the Democrats about Russian influence and zero about Israeli influence (which is much more overt, severe and out in the open), so it sure looks like our entire government is a rooted server at this point.
Cash out, destroy evidence, and feign innocence and ignorance.
The new administration will also be paid by the same foreign interests.
They've shifted the culture and normalized their actions. It was already heading in their direction before they came to power.
I didn't know Elif Shafak was active on HN.
She ain't, but I do get emails for her occasionally.
I am pretty darn jaded these days, but I find myself staggered.
edit after reply:
> What was odd, the source said, was that the money in the account—hundreds of millions of dollars—had come from a bank in Azerbaijan.
Ahh, now the arrest of the former chief of Germany's BND, related to what seemed like a random country "Azerbaijan" is making a bit more sense?
Azerbaijan isn't a random country in corruption contexts. It is a petro-state and run by a single family for their own enrichment. It's pretty expected to come up occasionally in these kind of stories.
I wouldn't read a connection between the two other than a lot of corruption flows through Azerbaijan.
I think that you’ll find that it’s pronounced “Aber-baijan”.
the corruption or that other countries are able to surface the corruption faster than we can?
> or that other countries are able to surface the corruption faster than we can?
A lot of the corruption just happens right out in the open here these days, doesn't even need to be surfaced.
https://wallhop.io/https://www.vanityfair.com/story/jared-ku...
http://archive.today/FHGAt
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If you live in Russia you should already have a circumvention method available
Russian network ingress/egress?
Works on my machine
Everything lately makes me want to re-watch Peter Finch's monologue from Network.
For the lazy asses: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZwMVMbmQBug
Why bother with hacks when it's an open secret that the US gov is compromised?
A lot of people still don't believe it despite increasing levels of proof. The proof is fighting against the world's most powerful media empires, which also prevent access to the proof.
Honestly, this story reeks of being a limited hangout:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Limited_hangout
Not to make this political, but if the democrats gain control they better at least actually try to prosecute these criminals and not just make it yet another circle jerk asking for donations and never actually accomplishing anything. At some point the ruling class is going to mess around and everyone’s head ends up on a pile regardless. This is the time to demonstrate your head doesn’t deserve on the pile too. Time is running out. Just saying. Things happen fast when they finally cross that threshold that always comes as a surprise.
Echoes of "Lock her up! Lock her up!"
On one hand, we have an email server where most of the classified information on it was classified for her own protection - like her location.
Meanwhile Trump and plenty of others have also practiced extremely poor email hygiene using non-official emails for all sorts of stuff. You don't hear about that from the Left because, well, there's all sorts of far more concerning shit happening.
Then, on the other hand, there's staggeringly large and previously unprecedented levels of corruption with this administration. We've never seen anything remotely like it, unless your argument is just that the Democrats are just vastly more competent at hiding it, despite constantly having all sorts of shit leak and just generally being totally incompetent at managing the party itself.
But if you don't understand the difference between the Hillary email situation and the staggering amount of blatantly illegal and massively corrupt things coming out of the Trump administration basically every single day, I don't know that there's any level of proof or any argument that could be made to change your mind.
Yes, the MO of the Trump administration is to blame the other side of what they're actually doing.
Loudly making unfounded or exaggerated claims of corruption is a pretty effective tool for muddying the waters and making it less clear where the smoke is coming from.
Are you:
A) a troll
B) truly unable to tell the difference
Spoiler: They won't.
They'll put another limp dick like Merrick Garland in charge
I also feel people are missing the forest for the trees in that discussion in that Jared Kushner is a private citizen and the son in law of the president who somehow is negotiating with foreign heads of states despite having no mandate from the American people to do so. Forget a hacked phone, why is a nepo baby running around negotiating on behalf of a country without holding any office
Because the most powerful nation on Earth turned out to be powerless against a carefully planned and executed Dismantling of Democracy attack.
[delayed]
I'm more interested to see if it revealed he is using it on Saturdays
I didn't think he's observant in any way?
Why would that be?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shabbat -> he's in bed with Israel -> someone mixing up Israel with Judaism?
Not that I particularly care about his religious practices, but Jared Kushner is also definitely Jewish.
Shabbat.
So Kushner's phone was hacked around the same time as Hunter Biden's laptop? Why has the latter captured the media so much more then the former?
This question and the potential answers are honestly the most interesting thing in this thread, so far.
Because the latter included clips of the presidents son smoking crack and hanging out with prostitutes? lol
The President’s son being a private citizen versus the President’s son in law being some pseudo-secretary of state?
Media had access to the laptop, and we only have second hand claims about the phone.
Boy, that sounds like a job for an investigative reporter with the public interest in mind.
Is there an alternate reality where the dem aligned mass media didn't completely bury the ridiculously salacious laptop story (drugs, money for access aaaand onlyfans level nudity!!) to steer the election?
Because i distinctly recall the head of what to that point I though was a credible journalistic organization saying she didnt want to "waste people's time" with that.
The alternate reality is the one where "dem aligned mass media _did_ completely bury" -- because it's all I heard about for months, and months, and months, and months, and months, and months, and months, and months, and months, and months, and months, and months, and months, and months.
You mean *after* the election, right? At which point it mattered f_all, other than the sheer entertainment value.
Biden's laptop was in the possession of a computer shop in the US, and the owner leaked its contents to the media.
Kushner's phone data was in the possession of Dutch intelligence who didn't want anyone to know that they had hacked the phone, and this was not public knowledge until today.
Biden’s laptop was in the possession of “someone” who brought it to a blind computer repair person (seriously!), who then got in touch with Rudy Giuliani, who then leaked the contents to the media… and so we can’t really know who actually gained possession of it. The repair man was blind lol.
crowd control on 4chan?
Accusation in a mirror
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Accusation_in_a_mirror
I think it's becoming clear that although the media just happily accepts the left-wing bias accusations, they are by no means left-wing. They shouted every random Biden mistake from the rooftops while this administration mostly gets a free pass.
> Why has the latter captured the media so much more then the former?
Kushner is a boring nerd and Biden is a Chad with a huge dong.
it's going to take decades to unravel all the corruption by this administration
it is staggering
and they are destroying records in violation of law
because "pardons for everyone" on the way out
"Corruption" isn't quite the right scale to use for this. Far deeper, more systemic. This is the disassembly of a state.
Much more equivalent to phenomenon surrounding the collapse of the Soviet Union: liquidation of an entire state's infrastructure via foreign exchange controlled exclusively by the security state . . with plenty of братва duocracy of course.
We've already seen equivalents, even before the 2008 Econopalypse, but activities like those of the Trump-affiliated circle is the terminal end: where USD-denominated assets are exchanged for pure state power. It's just that this is a particularly pure form of it.
There will be no unravelling of this, not until the system of USD seigniorage itself unravels.
This is the right answer to this. This is the beginning of dismantling of USD based system, US might suffer because of that but other countries now have no choice at all but to decouple the system relying in USD.
Kleptocracy
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kakistocracy
why would you need to destroy anything if there's pardons involved. Even if they have the proof you committed wrongdoing, the pardon means you suffer no consequences.
> why would you need to destroy anything if there's pardons involved.
To prosecute people guilty of state-level violations (which are not covered by Presidential federal-level pardons). To find 'collaborators' (and perhaps prosecute them, as it may difficult to pardon 'everyone'). To know what happened to perhaps help prevent it happening again in the future.
Well, that's why you commit your crimes in DC!
They still probably are violating plenty of state and local laws that the pardon won't do anything about.
That and there is an idea that the strength of pardons will be tested by the House Oversight Committee(assuming take back by Democrats).
IMO the pardon power was an absolute mistake and I’m totally fine with us just burning this bridge for good.
what happens if you are convicted in federal court before receiving the pardon. does double jeopardy come into play?
> and they are destroying records in violation of law
Nothing new and there will be no justice. Look up the guy in charge of MKUltra. He destroyed evidence and got a nice retirement.
Seems like the best case scenario is prosecution under state laws, which the presidential pardon cannot stop.
The best case scenario is probably drone strikes as "official acts" under Presidential immunity.
My understanding is that they don't need to destroy records related to Kushner because he's not a government employee, his records aren't required to be retained. And that is, no doubt, by design.
This article is about a phone hacking in 2017 when he was still a federal employee. Russia hacked his iPhone X around then.
This kind of stuff gives an insight into how horrible centralized governance is. All these manipulations happening behind the scenes constantly which people are affected by but can't make sense of. It's not really surprising though, it's just part of the system. The system is designed in a way to attract certain people and make them behave a certain way. Power should be much more decentralized so that this doesn't happen.
The reason that power centralizes is that decentralized powers tend to get outcompeted (in the short run) by centralized powers.
Then there should be a centralized power whose only power is to enforce the decentralization of power. Basically a bunch of agents who go around and get paid to legally remove from power anyone who gets too powerful politically or financially and that's all they do and can do. There should be a crime 'Overaccumulation of power' which carries a jail sentence and a special court made up of a large random jury who vote on each case.
The jury is asked to vote if a person is too powerful and also there is a question "Do you recognize who this person/entity is?" and if some non-trivial percentage of people answer 'yes', then they it means this person has too much power and they get removed from all their positions immediately. Also there can be another test like this related to wealth; so if wealth is above a certain high limit (like $100 million), they are offered to either donate everything above the limit to a UBI fund or they go to jail until the amount falls below the limit.
I think such system would out-compete centralized systems which do not have such limits.
I am very jaded about the current administration and also the previous...few...or several? That being said, similar to the Hunter Biden laptop situation, I think you do have to be careful. Sure they -could- have the device or it -could- have been hacked, but what is the proof that the hacked or on-device information wasn't planted among real items to make it appear legitimate? That was always the big if for me with the Hunter stuff, so I will extend the same skepticism here, knowing full well it could definitely be true in either case.
Its just good business.
Hold on honey I want to read what HN has to say about Jared Kushner.